Synergy Tech Support

Synergy Electric Helicopters => Synergy E7SE => Topic started by: benben on June 11, 2012, 08:12:04 AM

Title: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: benben on June 11, 2012, 08:12:04 AM
My 18t mushroom gear is worn out only after a few flights.

[attachment deleted by admin]
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: Darren Lee on June 11, 2012, 03:15:46 PM
What is that red part?
Title: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: Kevin Dalrymple on June 11, 2012, 04:25:43 PM
What's the tail drive smooth when it was built? It looks like it had the incorrect mesh.
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: steffgiguere on June 11, 2012, 04:39:44 PM
Red thing puzzles me too.
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: Kevin Feil on June 11, 2012, 05:06:57 PM
It almost looks like Red Tape, I don't see any brush strokes that would indicated Paint?? Interesting.. ???


Kevin
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: benben on June 11, 2012, 06:19:32 PM
Red part is a piece of heat shrink that I use to keep the pin from comming out in case the set screw loosen. The tail was smooth when I installed it. It is still smooth now with the excessive wear.
Title: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: Tommy Wagner on June 11, 2012, 07:25:54 PM
Edit
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: benben on June 11, 2012, 08:56:46 PM
yes I have the set screw in place. It's only for added security. Anyway the problem is the gear not the little piece of heat shrink.
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: Darren Lee on June 12, 2012, 02:28:20 PM
Maybe somehow your mesh is too tight?  I have over 100 flights on mine and all the gears look new.
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: stevehof on June 12, 2012, 04:53:55 PM
I have 80 or more flights on my E7 torque tube and the gears look fine. Has anyone dragged the tail or otherwise biffed the tail on the torque tube setup yet? I'm very curious to know where the tail system is going to fail. Almost looks like the tail got biffed lightly at some point. Although you'd think the tail blade ends would fail before the umbrella gears got squished that much. Benben, is the gear worn the same all the way around or does it have 'one side' worse than the other?
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: steffgiguere on June 12, 2012, 05:44:18 PM
Ask Superyan711 on here. He crashed his E7 two week-ends ago, not one gear broke of lost one tooth.
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: stevehof on June 12, 2012, 05:52:42 PM
Ask Superyan711 on here. He crashed his E7 two week-ends ago, not one gear broke of lost one tooth.
Sounds good but what I'm interested in knowing is what happens when you drag the tail hard under power or crash on the tail. I would think something other than just the tail blades will give out. Yes, I too like the beefy gears and what looks like a well thought out design. However, nothing is bulletproof...LOL
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: Darren Lee on June 12, 2012, 05:57:07 PM
When I crashed the only gear that broke was the 54T spur.
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: stevehof on June 12, 2012, 06:00:10 PM
When I crashed the only gear that broke was the 54T spur.
Thanks, just wondering what part of the tail drive was most vulnerable. So your umbrella gears came out unscathed? They don't look a bit tweaked like Benben's?
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: benben on June 12, 2012, 08:36:58 PM
I have 80 or more flights on my E7 torque tube and the gears look fine. Has anyone dragged the tail or otherwise biffed the tail on the torque tube setup yet? I'm very curious to know where the tail system is going to fail. Almost looks like the tail got biffed lightly at some point. Although you'd think the tail blade ends would fail before the umbrella gears got squished that much. Benben, is the gear worn the same all the way around or does it have 'one side' worse than the other?
The gear is worn all the way around.
Title: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: Chris Sexton on June 12, 2012, 08:50:32 PM
When I crashed the only gear that broke was the 54T spur.

I wrapped my tail around a tree. Only gear that stripped was the spur too. Stripped every tooth.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: Jean-Luc Bolduc on June 13, 2012, 09:12:47 PM
I have 120 flights on my TT between E6 and E7 and doing lots of tic tocs and most piros against torque and my gears look like new, so there has to some other reason this is happening to you. Most likely it's mesh that was too loose or too tight and melted or softened up with friction heat. Put new gears and inspect mesh very closely before bolting cage back in frames.
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: benben on June 14, 2012, 03:12:41 AM
how do you adjust the mesh?
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: Chris McVey on June 14, 2012, 04:31:52 PM
Here is a general example from youtube on how to set proper gear mesh. How to set gear mesh clearance (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BpVQq-7qFEE#ws)

This is not my video, just something I search for.


Thanks,
Chris
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: stevehof on June 14, 2012, 05:03:05 PM
I don't think you can adjust the mesh on the gears on the torque tube front transmission.
Title: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: Tommy Wagner on June 14, 2012, 05:16:05 PM
Just a thought:

Look where the pins go sit in the gear and make sure that there is nothing in there and that the gear is as far down (or up) as it can go if there is something keeping either one from being all the way on the mesh will be tight.
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: Jean-Luc Bolduc on June 14, 2012, 08:40:02 PM
If the back gears are not showing signs of wear, then that would be a clue that there is a mesh problem of some sort on the front ones. They are close to the same tooth count and size. Possibly your torque tube is pushing against the horizontal bevel gear and tightening it's mesh too much. The TT should slide in all the way and retracted 1 or 2 mm to avoid pushing on the gear while at speed. Same thing for the back transmission. Worth checking.
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: Matt Botos on June 14, 2012, 09:16:43 PM
This is definitely not normal. It looks like a heat/mesh related issue. Production gears on my helicopter have hundreds of flights with very little signs of wear. I would check to make sure your TT is not applying pressure to the output mushroom gear. Make sure your boom is not riding against the bearing block. A TT that is pushing on the mushroom gear will change the mesh of the two bevel gears.

Thanks,

Matt
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: benben on June 18, 2012, 08:45:44 PM
I just changed both of the front trans gears and after two flights the 18T mushroom gear is showing signs of wear again and with lots of black dust. I did pull back the boom a little this time.
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: Matt Botos on June 21, 2012, 10:34:20 PM
Is the front transmission smooth outside of the helicopter? A little bit of dust on break in is normal. The gears in your pictures look melted.

Thanks,

Matt
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: benben on June 22, 2012, 01:35:37 AM
Not silky smooth when new and out of the heli. The gear I posted is not melted just worn with lots of black dust. My boom was flush with the front boom clamp when I first installed the TT kit and now I've pulled back the boom about 2mm.
When I installed the new gear, there were almost no play between both of the front gears but after 2 flights the mesh became quite big. I am waiting for my third front gear to arrive.
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: Matt Botos on June 22, 2012, 02:08:24 AM
Ben,

My suggestion would be to remove the front transmission, disassemble everything, and start from scratch.
Make sure the mushroom gear is pressed completely into the bearings and bearings are fully seated in the bearing block.
Try leaving the bolts slightly loose and checking the gear mesh. Slowly tighten everything down to see if the gear mesh becomes too tight.
Make sure transmission parts are all present per the online manual.
Make certain transmission is smooth before reinstalling into the helicopter.
Gears should have very little lash when they are brand new.

Matt
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: Bill Martin on June 24, 2012, 09:46:26 PM
May be a torque tube bearing is out of the housing.
Title: Re: 18T Front Trans Mushroom Gear worn out
Post by: Pete Busch on June 26, 2012, 06:51:03 AM
When I took my front tranny apart to loctite it and put it back together I found you can get the two carbon fiber plates out of square which will cause the two bevel gears to have a tight notchy mesh. All you have to do is hold it square on your table and tighten up all the screws little by little making sure the mesh is smooth.