Author Topic: Synergy N5C Flybarless Belt Drive Kit for a first nitro? (Read 23516 times)

Jon Mills · « **Reply #30 on:** October 25, 2013, 03:17:16 PM »

I have used VP Powermaster with great success. The difference between boat car and heli fuel is the amount of nitro-methane and the amount or percent of lubricant. I have bought a 6 gallon case of 30% Powermaster heli from amainhobbies for +/-$160 to my door here in NM. Anyway 6 gallon case to the usual 4 is what lured me in but the performance and long engine life is what kept me buying it. I figured I would share my thoughts, there are a lot of fuels and a lot of mixes out there, half the fun is figuring out which one you like best.

Jon M

Rodney Kirstine · « **Reply #31 on:** October 25, 2013, 03:53:21 PM »

I've run Coolpower because I can get it locally and I've also run a couple of cases of Torco fuel and I've had really good luck with both. I bought the Torco because they don't charge shipping or hazmat fees. The price is about the same as what I can buy Coolpower for, locally, it's just a bit easier for me to have it shipped because the LHS that I can get fuel from is pretty far out of my way.

KevinM · « **Reply #32 on:** October 28, 2013, 10:37:11 AM »

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Awesome...thanks for posting that. I especially like the part where Tim says, "My tune is not equal to your tune, or anyone elses." LOL...truer words have never been spoken

THIS is such a true statement, new folks, want their engine to sound like what they hear in videos or in person..I also to this day cant get a 55 to sound like Matts N5c w/o being un happy at some point through the tank start to finish. It really is an art form. I'm still learning it myself. If you sport fly your needle settings are going to be WAY different than someone who does hard 3D. With the heli under constant load doing 3D you'll have to be richer than a sport flyer... Trouble is when a sport flyer or even to take this a step further "someone new", gets the engine boarderline lean or tuned, as soon as they get into an oops situation they get really aggerssive on the sticks to save the heli. This may not be entirely true but Id say your going to end up passing over the safe zone of the tune and go lean..(correct me if Im wrong guys). I would say tune it where you still get great flight times but keep it rich so if you have to make up for a possible crash to save the heli you arent going into the red! Even sllightly rich the engine is still going to make great power. Boarderline lean the power decreases or gets lazy as previoulsy mentioned and at that point your overall HS is going to drop which is not going to do you any favors while the heli is rapidly heading toward its demise!

The SmackTalk vids are a great resource..I've used quite a few, well done! However, something to remember about the tuning video is it was either the first or one of the first videos they've done so that being said it lacked alot of indepth explanation IMO. I would hope that now that the nervousness of being in front of a camera and charging money for a product they would go back and re-release an updated version. The Tim Jones videos "tuning 101" with Finless was alot more helpful so definitely check that out if you havent. I watched those over and over to begin hearing what Tim was explaining.

Fuels--I've run CoolPower and RotorRage. CoolPower works just fine...but if I had to compare and be just picky I really feel like the RR because it seems to run cooler, runs cleaner (doesnt bronze the inside of the engine), and seems to have a tad more power. Trouble is I suffer the same fate most of us do and I cant get RR in my area...(I think HobbyTown here is beginning to carry it but wants $42 a gallon! YIKES!) It doesnt hurt that RR smells pretty nice too LOL, not that matters but..

Rodney Kirstine · « **Reply #33 on:** October 28, 2013, 11:27:30 AM »

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(I think HobbyTown here is beginning to carry it but wants $42 a gallon! YIKES!) It doesnt hurt that RR smells pretty nice too LOL, not that matters but..

Wow, that's crazy! Before reading your post, I had forgotten that I won a gallon of RotorRage at a fun fly and I did like it. I didn't look into buying any because I already had a couple of cases of Torco but, yeah, it seems like good stuff.

KevinM · « **Reply #34 on:** October 28, 2013, 01:21:23 PM »

Something to be noted..and please dont take this to the bank because maybe I twisted needles and forgot that I had. But IF memory serves..... I was running RR in the YS60sr and got it tuned Friday night at HeliExtravaganza and that was my last tank of it. I then had a gallon of CP Heli 30% that apparently is some new blend with low smoke. First tank of the day around 9-10 the YS went lean in the first quarter tank...thats odd! So, I dont know if theres a huge difference in the nitro/oil content but it was enough to make it go lean in a hover. At that point it was new fuel tubing and the motor and tubing only had 12 flights on it. So I'd like to think it wasnt because air was seeping in somewhere. Just a thought if you guys happen to get this low smoke coolpower. ...again maybe it was just me.

flyalan · « **Reply #35 on:** October 28, 2013, 03:19:01 PM »

I have been running CY Wildcat 30% in the N5C for over a year with good result. The engine runs like champ.
My 105 will be using RR15% initially since Tommy Whitaker had a case at a local event.

Cheers
Alan

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Jon Mills · « **Reply #36 on:** October 28, 2013, 04:11:41 PM »

Here is something I have a love hate relationship with. The temperature of a os 55 or 50 when running under power should be around 210 to 220 degrees Fahrenheit. If you have telemetry then it will be easier. If you don't, and I don't you can use a temp gun. A sound piece of advice is try to measure the same exact spot on the head. With the temp gun its going to be really difficult to get an accurate reading, only a person with telemetry could tell you what the temp change is when going from running to on the ground. So if anybody knows this answer please fill me in.

What I have done lately is install a traxxas on board temp gauge($20) on the heli. The great thing about it is it will recall the extremes of the flight with a push of the button.

I don't recommend using temp to get to a final tune, rather a tool to ensure your not too lean on your quest to that final tune

Again please figure out what works best for you, this is only my opinion and should be treated as such.

Jon M

KevinM · « **Reply #37 on:** October 29, 2013, 07:55:43 AM »

You know this is an interesting topic (chapawolf), I heard once that while flying, telemetry would read a higher temp (above 220) than it would if you landed, got the blades stopped, turned the heli over and shoved a temp gun to the seam of the head and crankcase...sounds like minimal steps but there IS about 30secs of cooling before the temp gun hits the head... Is this right? ..and if you have telemetry what is the safe temp for operation while its still airbourne?

Rctintin · « **Reply #38 on:** October 29, 2013, 08:59:23 PM »

This is a great source of information guys, but it's a shame its tied into this thread so others cannot find it if they were looking for help with tuning.

Would it be possible for a mod to copy and paste some of this thread and start a tuning thread with this and more info in it?

Keep it coming though, its all great reading and help.

flyalan · « **Reply #39 on:** October 29, 2013, 09:08:21 PM »

I have my N5C running at about 230 during the summer months. Per the telemetry.
Makes good smoke and is definitely not running lean. The temp sensor is at the base of the cylinder head.

Cheers
Alan

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Jon Mills · « **Reply #40 on:** October 29, 2013, 11:33:20 PM »

Yes Kevin and Alan I think both of your are right on the money. I have heard a lot of people say 230 is the max, but I typically don't see a good clean run until 230 or even 250. I also know that it will take Excessivly more heat than 230 to stop a motor on one run. I think for somebody who is paranoid about being lean and doesn't have telemetry these numbers being kicked around are a good starting place.

Jon M

flyalan · « **Reply #41 on:** October 30, 2013, 03:34:34 AM »

Not paranoid. I have been using the same power settings for quite some time and my OS55 makes plenty of power. I do make minor high speed needle changes due to OAT.
Yes ONE lean run may not kill your motor but it will definitely shorten the lifespan.
So what temps are you seeing on your Nitros?

Cheers
Alan

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KevinM · « **Reply #42 on:** October 30, 2013, 09:18:28 AM »

I personally dont have a telemetry radio, but I do tend to pocket my temp gauge just about every flight incase I hear the engine leaning out...because we all know that different days are different temps and further more morning to afternoon can change drastically especially in the south. You start out with a jacket and by the afternoon your in a long/short sleeve shirt.

That being said if your running 190-210 keep it there (not talking to my telemetry guys) ..If you are at 220 you better be on your game with collective mgmt. For example I saw a video of Nick Maxwell flying someones N5c and he said the high needle is lean so I'll just finish out the flight on the mid needle...CRAZY. I'm not that good I can assure you! LOL. But thats the difference...just keep at 200-210 max and leave it. At that point if your loading it up, chances are its you not the engine not being spot on tuned!

KevinM

flyalan · « **Reply #43 on:** October 30, 2013, 10:02:09 AM »

I am not tuning my engines based on the telemetry readings. Those are just reassurance that I am in fact not running too lean. I base my settings on performance, smoke and sound. Checking a temp either direct or via telemetry is just added insurance in my book.

Cheers
Alan

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KevinM · « **Reply #44 on:** October 30, 2013, 11:45:28 AM »

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Yes ONE lean run may not kill your motor but it will definitely shorten the lifespan.

There is one thing I'll say to this from experience....The OS55 I ran lean a good handful of times just kept going, no rough starts..didnt have to idle up to get it running and still pulled fairly well. But as Alan has mentioned and from what I could tell the lifespan dropped significantly. Id fly others 55's and could tell my 55 was BEAT! lol

...Darren prob took one look at my piston, ring and sleeve (gave him my 55) and said dang kevin..you got your mileage out of this engine! LOL